Wikipedia:Peer review/Here We Go Again (Ray Charles song)/archive2

Here We Go Again (Ray Charles song)

Previous peer review

This peer review discussion has been closed.
I've listed this article for peer review because the previous FAC failed. The article needs both a WP:MOS review and an WP:NFCC review. I hope to get both in one PR, but realize I may need to open a second dedicated review.

Thanks, TonyTheTiger (T/C/BIO/WP:CHICAGO/WP:FOUR) 00:13, 29 August 2011 (UTC)

• "In November 1959 after a dozen years in the business"; I wouldn't say dozen, and should be rewritten
  • Note sure what you are getting at, tried more than a decade.--TonyTheTiger (T/C/BIO/WP:CHICAGO/WP:FOUR) 05:27, 9 September 2011 (UTC)
    • (twelve) — Preceding unsigned comment added by SCB '92 (talk • contribs) 12:00:18, 9 September 2011 (UTC)
      • Fixed.--TonyTheTiger (T/C/BIO/WP:CHICAGO/WP:FOUR) 12:23, 9 September 2011 (UTC)
• "In the 1960s, he experienced crossover success." is that it?
  • What do you want me to do. The rest of the paragraph expounds on that point showing how he ventured into country music and endeared white fans.--TonyTheTiger (T/C/BIO/WP:CHICAGO/WP:FOUR) 12:50, 9 September 2011 (UTC)
• "to the point where began to have more white fans than black." needs an "it"
  • Fixed.--TonyTheTiger (T/C/BIO/WP:CHICAGO/WP:FOUR) 12:25, 9 September 2011 (UTC)
• "Because ABC signed him as a rhythm and blues singer he waited until his contract was up for its three-year renewal before experimenting with country music although he wanted to do so sooner." commas, anyone?
  • Fixed.--TonyTheTiger (T/C/BIO/WP:CHICAGO/WP:FOUR) 05:48, 9 September 2011 (UTC)
• "The album tour playlist is not readily available..." out of place?
  • What do you mean?--TonyTheTiger (T/C/BIO/WP:CHICAGO/WP:FOUR) 05:47, 9 September 2011 (UTC)
    • is it suposed to be in present tense? — Preceding unsigned comment added by SCB '92 (talk • contribs) 12:05:45, 9 September 2011 (UTC)
      • Why not?--TonyTheTiger (T/C/BIO/WP:CHICAGO/WP:FOUR) 22:32, 12 September 2011 (UTC)
• So many red links;wikilinks of nonexisting articles should be eliminated
  • Fixed.--TonyTheTiger (T/C/BIO/WP:CHICAGO/WP:FOUR) 12:36, 9 September 2011 (UTC)
• "In May, the band played Carnegie Hall back in the United States before returning to California." doesn't sound right?
  • I am following the source, which does not mention NY until the Copa in the fall. Also, I am not a music person and am not sure if Reno and the Copa still count as part of the tour. The source makes clear the next album was not begun until after the Copa, so I assumed all the bookings were sort of part of his Album tour or at least related to it.--TonyTheTiger (T/C/BIO/WP:CHICAGO/WP:FOUR) 05:43, 9 September 2011 (UTC)
    • no mention of state of New York, where Carnegie Hall is located at, then suddenly mentioning the country of the US then the state of California? — Preceding unsigned comment added by SCB '92 (talk • contribs) 12:05:45, 9 September 2011 (UTC)
      • In terms of Carnegie Hall, I think adding New York City is more helpful since we have the detail.--TonyTheTiger (T/C/BIO/WP:CHICAGO/WP:FOUR) 12:21, 9 September 2011 (UTC)
• "Washington DC"; isn't it "Washington, D.C."? if it is, it shouldn't redirect
  • Fixed.--TonyTheTiger (T/C/BIO/WP:CHICAGO/WP:FOUR) 05:33, 9 September 2011 (UTC)
• "The tour also had an extended fall run at the Copa"; should fully read "Copacabana nightclub"
  • Fixed.--TonyTheTiger (T/C/BIO/WP:CHICAGO/WP:FOUR) 05:40, 9 September 2011 (UTC)
• "Steagall and Lanier are credited as the writers of this song from their work on its original version in 1967. The song was not a new song." source? and the last sentence is short and out of place
  • Reffed.--TonyTheTiger (T/C/BIO/WP:CHICAGO/WP:FOUR) 13:17, 9 September 2011 (UTC)

did this help?-SCB '92 (talk) 17:10, 8 September 2011 (UTC)

• Yes. I need all the help I can get. Feel free to add further comments.--TonyTheTiger (T/C/BIO/WP:CHICAGO/WP:FOUR) 13:17, 9 September 2011 (UTC)

Comments by Jivesh

 Doing... Jivesh • Talk2Me 05:21, 9 September 2011 (UTC)

Infobox

• No mention of recording locations, year of recording?
  • Added location.--TonyTheTiger (T/C/BIO/WP:CHICAGO/WP:FOUR) 13:31, 9 September 2011 (UTC)
• Is soul as a genre sourced in the coming paragraph?
  • Removed.--TonyTheTiger (T/C/BIO/WP:CHICAGO/WP:FOUR) 13:42, 9 September 2011 (UTC)

Lead

• but none on country music charts >>> My English teacher says to avoid using but and replace it with however
  • O.K.--TonyTheTiger (T/C/BIO/WP:CHICAGO/WP:FOUR) 13:19, 9 September 2011 (UTC)
    • Interesting. Why did she say that? --Efe (talk) 11:32, 10 September 2011 (UTC)
• spent twelve weeks >>> consecutive?
  • done.--TonyTheTiger (T/C/BIO/WP:CHICAGO/WP:FOUR) 13:48, 9 September 2011 (UTC)
• on the Billboard Hot 100 >>> on the US Billboard Hot 100 chart
  • Fixed.--TonyTheTiger (T/C/BIO/WP:CHICAGO/WP:FOUR) 03:05, 29 September 2011 (UTC)
• the duet cover on that album earned the 2005 Grammy Award for Record of the Year and Best Pop Collaboration at the 47th Grammy Awards >>> remove either 2005 or at the 47th Grammy Awards
  • O.K.--TonyTheTiger (T/C/BIO/WP:CHICAGO/WP:FOUR) 13:52, 9 September 2011 (UTC)
• many of its other notable covers have been on country music albums. >>> many of its other notable covers were featured on the track-listings on country music albums.
  • O.K.--TonyTheTiger (T/C/BIO/WP:CHICAGO/WP:FOUR) 03:18, 10 September 2011 (UTC)
• It was first covered >>> How many times will you use it it it???
  • Fixed.--TonyTheTiger (T/C/BIO/WP:CHICAGO/WP:FOUR) 20:53, 10 September 2011 (UTC)

General comment on Lead: Please do not get me wrong but the lead is not a good one. You stress too much on cover versions

Guidelines for a lead (good one)

Do the pointers below apply to a song of this age and one with two really prominent versions? Looking at WP:FA and the 5 songs within 10 years in either direction from this song ("Hey Jude", "The Long and Winding Road", "What'd I Say", "Like a Rolling Stone", "Layla"), all but one of the WP:LEADs is only 2 paragraphs.--TonyTheTiger (T/C/BIO/WP:CHICAGO/WP:FOUR) 20:58, 10 September 2011 (UTC)

First paragraph:

• Song, recording artist, album
• who wrote it, produce it
• Any information about background (was it originally for another artist, was it leaked....)
• What motivated its development

Second paragraph

• Genre(s) of song

Any influences or display of elements of other musical(s) genre(s)

• characteristics (ballad, etc)
• Did it gain any comparison?
• What does the lyrical content refer to?

Third paragraph

• What did critics say?
• commercial reception?
• Live performance

Fourth paragraph

• Cover version

Jivesh • Talk2Me 05:38, 9 September 2011 (UTC)

Fix these issues first. Quite a lot of work awaiting you. Jivesh • Talk2Me 05:38, 9 September 2011 (UTC)

I will continue in a while. Jivesh boodhun (talk / Make sure you give 4 a try!!!) 04:12, 13 September 2011 (UTC)

Original version

• after twelve years in the business  ???
  • does this seem irrelevant to you?--TonyTheTiger (T/C/BIO/WP:CHICAGO/WP:FOUR) 20:54, 15 September 2011 (UTC)
    • Can the in the business thing be changed? Jivesh 1205 (talk / Make sure you give 4 a try!!!) 04:47, 16 September 2011 (UTC)
      • I changed "in the business" to "as a professional musician". Is this what you mean?--TonyTheTiger (T/C/BIO/WP:CHICAGO/WP:FOUR) 16:31, 17 September 2011 (UTC)

Looks fine to me now. ★Jivesh 1205★ (talk / ♫♫Give 4 a try!!!♫♫) 10:32, 1 October 2011 (UTC)

• Link country music
  • Why are we linking this a second time.--TonyTheTiger (T/C/BIO/WP:CHICAGO/WP:FOUR) 20:43, 15 September 2011 (UTC)

Sorry. My mistake. ★Jivesh 1205★ (talk / ♫♫Give 4 a try!!!♫♫) 10:32, 1 October 2011 (UTC)

• The tour got bad reviews from publications >>> received
  • Fixed.--TonyTheTiger (T/C/BIO/WP:CHICAGO/WP:FOUR) 00:01, 24 September 2011 (UTC)

Good. ★Jivesh 1205★ (talk / ♫♫Give 4 a try!!!♫♫) 10:32, 1 October 2011 (UTC)

• Link the music notes G3 ... C5
  • This was done.--TonyTheTiger (T/C/BIO/WP:CHICAGO/WP:FOUR) 01:30, 20 September 2011 (UTC)

Okay. ★Jivesh 1205★ (talk / ♫♫Give 4 a try!!!♫♫) 10:32, 1 October 2011 (UTC)

• Billboard wrote >>> Billboard magazine wrote
  • I think this has already been fixed.--TonyTheTiger (T/C/BIO/WP:CHICAGO/WP:FOUR) 00:00, 29 September 2011 (UTC)

Good. ★Jivesh 1205★ (talk / ♫♫Give 4 a try!!!♫♫) 10:32, 1 October 2011 (UTC)

• "Another excellent example of how Ray Charles was able to fuse blues and country, 'Here We Go Again' is a soulful ballad in the Southern blues tradition. Lyrically, it has a resignation and pain that makes the blues, simply, what it is. The recording has a simple and sterling gospel arrangement and, in retrospect, is one of Charles' finer attempts in the studio from the 1960s."

Won't this fit better in composition section?

• • Mostly moved already.--TonyTheTiger (T/C/BIO/WP:CHICAGO/WP:FOUR) 02:46, 29 September 2011 (UTC)

It looks good now. ★Jivesh 1205★ (talk / ♫♫Give 4 a try!!!♫♫) 10:32, 1 October 2011 (UTC)

• on the Billboard Hot 100 >>> on the US Billboard Hot 100 chart
  • Fixed.--TonyTheTiger (T/C/BIO/WP:CHICAGO/WP:FOUR) 03:05, 29 September 2011 (UTC)

Good. ★Jivesh 1205★ (talk / ♫♫Give 4 a try!!!♫♫) 10:32, 1 October 2011 (UTC)

• Add US in front of each chart compiled by Billboard magazine and add the word chart at the end.
  • I have looked through WP:SONG's WP:FAs and this does not seem to be the prevailing convention. See 4 Minutes (Madonna song), Baby Boy (Beyoncé Knowles song), City of Blinding Lights, and Déjà Vu (Beyoncé Knowles song), which are the first 4 alphabetically with Billboard content.--TonyTheTiger (T/C/BIO/WP:CHICAGO/WP:FOUR) 21:17, 27 September 2011 (UTC)
    • I decided to do it on first instances.--TonyTheTiger (T/C/BIO/WP:CHICAGO/WP:FOUR) 03:05, 29 September 2011 (UTC)

Nice. ★Jivesh 1205★ (talk / ♫♫Give 4 a try!!!♫♫) 10:32, 1 October 2011 (UTC)

• Why three paragraphs for Chart performance? Can't they be merged?

You have not replied to this. ★Jivesh 1205★ (talk / ♫♫Give 4 a try!!!♫♫) 10:32, 1 October 2011 (UTC)

They are separate subjects. The first describes the overall success of all tracks on the album at first. Then, there is a paragraph specific to this song domestically. The third paragraph is for the song on international charts. Maybe the 2nd and 3rd might be merged.--TonyTheTiger (T/C/BIO/WP:CHICAGO/WP:FOUR) 23:39, 5 October 2011 (UTC)

• • • Everything else looks great. Jivesh boodhun (talk / Make sure you give 4 a try!!!) 16:15, 14 September 2011 (UTC)
      • I will continue later. I am very busy with school these days. Jivesh boodhun (talk / Make sure you give 4 a try!!!) 16:15, 14 September 2011 (UTC)

Quick comments by Efe

• "Norah Jones/Ray Charles duet version" is the slash there appropriate? Does it translate to "and" and not "or"?--Efe (talk) 10:38, 27 September 2011 (UTC)
  • Changed to and.--TonyTheTiger (T/C/BIO/WP:CHICAGO/WP:FOUR) 21:04, 27 September 2011 (UTC)

Jivesh boodhun, can you comment on my progress on the above issues.--TonyTheTiger (T/C/BIO/WP:CHICAGO/WP:FOUR) 00:00, 1 October 2011 (UTC)

Sorry for late reply. I will do so in 5 hours. ★Jivesh 1205★ (talk / ♫♫Give 4 a try!!!♫♫) 03:49, 1 October 2011 (UTC)

Best if you can strike issues as they are resolved.--TonyTheTiger (T/C/BIO/WP:CHICAGO/WP:FOUR) 04:07, 1 October 2011 (UTC)

I'll respond later today or tomorrow.--TonyTheTiger (T/C/BIO/WP:CHICAGO/WP:FOUR) 00:48, 4 October 2011 (UTC)

Hey. Did you give any reconsideration to the LEAD considering what type of public information is available for 44 year old songs and in the face of other FAs of songs of similar age.--TonyTheTiger (T/C/BIO/WP:CHICAGO/WP:FOUR) 00:34, 6 October 2011 (UTC)

I am trying to get a response before the bot closes this discussion. I will ping your talk page.--TonyTheTiger (T/C/BIO/WP:CHICAGO/WP:FOUR) 00:06, 10 October 2011 (UTC)

Jivesh boodhun, Still hoping for some advice.--TonyTheTiger (T/C/BIO/WP:CHICAGO/WP:FOUR) 00:26, 8 October 2011 (UTC)