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Talk:2010–11 PFC CSKA Sofia season

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Format

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Latest comment: 13 years ago5 comments2 people in discussion

I took the liberty of reformatting the article so it now matches the format used by the articles on CSKA's 2009–10 and 2008–09 seasons. Any objections to that could be raised and discussed here. --Магьосник (talk) 08:00, 15 July 2010 (UTC)Reply

Re:Format

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Hello, Магьосник, I'm the one that contributed to the pages regarding the last 2 seasons of CSKA. I wanted to use new formats for the matches, because I beleive this page could develop with every year and I don't want to use the same template for every year. --Becksperson (talk) 16:00, 19 July 2010 (UTC)Reply

Well, please accept congratulations on your remarkable work then!
About the different formats, I think the consistency of the encyclopedia is something that matters and does not deserve to be neglected. Also, we should estimate which format is capable of being more informative for the reader.


Format used up to now
20 August 2009 Play-off Round Leg 1 CSKA 0 – 0   Dynamo Moscow Sofia
20:00 EEST Orlinov   45'
Yanchev   81'		 (Report) Fernández   42'
Kombarov   45'
Roptan   90+2'		 Stadium: Vasil Levski
Attendance: 23,250
Referee: Robert Schörgenhofer (Austria)
27 August 2009 Play-off Round Leg 2 Dynamo Moscow   1 – 2 CSKA Moscow, Russia
18:00 MST Kerzhakov   10'
Kombarov   86'		 (Report) Delev   14'
I. Ivanov   55'		 Stadium: Arena Khimki
Attendance: 8,486
Referee: Michael Weiner (Germany)
17 September 2009 Group Stage Matchday 1 CSKA 1 – 1   Fulham Sofia
20:00 EEST Michel Platini   62'
Minev   30'
Michel Platini   90'
Marquinhos   90+3'		 (Report) Kamara   65'
Greening   23'
Smalling   47'
Kamara   89'		 Stadium: Vasil Levski
Attendance: 28,000
Referee: Darko Čeferin (Slovenia)
1 October 2009 Group Stage Matchday 2 Roma   2 – 0 CSKA Rome, Italy
21:05 CEST Okaka Chuka   20'
Perrotta   23'
Menez   90+2'		 (Report) Stadium: Stadio Olimpico
Attendance: 16,027
Referee: Vladimír Hriňák (Slovakia)


Newly proposed format
Kick Off Opponent Venue Result
F / A 		Scorers Referee Attendance Report
2009-08-20 20:00 EEST   Dynamo Moscow   Vasil Levski, Sofia 0–0 –   Robert Schörgenhofer 23,250 MR
2010-06-27 18:00 MST   Dynamo Moscow   Arena Khimki, Moscow 2–1 Delev   14'
I. Ivanov   55' 		  Michael Weiner 8,486 MR
2009-09-17 20:00 EEST   Fulham   Vasil Levski, Sofia 1–1 Michel Platini   62'   Darko Čeferin 28,000 MR
2009-10-01 21:05 CEST   Roma   Stadio Olimpico, Rome 0–2 –   Vladimír Hriňák 16,027 MR


The latter fails to show the opponent's scorers and the cautions. If we supply those for the table too, it will get exceptionally overburdened, and that would apply particularly much for not-so-wide screen monitors. The former, meanwhile, uses template:footballbox_collapsible, whose very purpose is to neatly and compactly present all the notable data for a football game. Your opinion is of course valuable too, even more so as many articles in this category and the subcategories thereof prefer the tables format. We can revert the variant as it was, if you would like so.
One possible improvement I was thinking of recently could be the inclusion of some text, like what has been done here, for instance. And also, you've probably noticed that I supplied some extra sources for the pre-season friendlies. That was because some of the information, regarding most often the kick-off time and sometimes some scorers and yellow card receivers, was not in the main report given originally. I was aiming to provide verifiability for every detail mentioned. If we could find a comprehensive source that mentions every item of statistics we have included in the game infobox, then we wouldn't need any additional sources.
Cheers! It's still me, I gave up my old sig. --Theurgist (talk) 04:17, 20 July 2010 (UTC)Reply
Hi, I took the new pattern exactly from the Liverpool site, but it is not necessary to be that way. It would be great if we have text regarding the performances for each month, but we should clear out what kind of information should consist in those texts.
Another idea that came up to my mind is to use the format of FC Bayern München for the season results, because the league matches are take most of the space, so it could be great if we keep all of the matches information but in less space. The same format was used on the page for the last season of Steaua Bucuresti. You may see that I took a lot of the formats from there and implemented them in the current CSKA Sofia page.
What bothers me most is to find a proper way to distribute as much as possible information regarding the friendlies (although in gong.bg, sportal.bg and other Bulgarian websites there is not so many) and also to keep the links that you brought up from the opponent's websites. Another thing is to have a proper format regarding the European matches with group tables (if CSKA succeeds to go in the group phase again, hopefully they will do!) and detailed match information. Maybe we could make a special page regarding the matches of CSKA in Europe (historically and for the current season). --Becksperson (talk) 06:12, 20 July 2010 (UTC)Reply
FC Bayern 2009/10 format
Match
 Date
 Ground
 Opponent
 Score1
 Pos.
 Pts.
 GD
 Report
1 8 August A 1899 Hoffenheim 1 – 1 10 1 0
Report Report link
Kick off
18:30 CEST
Attendance
30,150 (capacity)
Referee
1899 Hoffenheim Bayern Munich
Obasi   41'
Olić   25'
van Bommel   76'
Müller   90'
2 15 August H Werder Bremen 1 – 1 11 2 0
Report Report link
Kick off
15:30 CEST
Attendance
69,000 (capacity)
Referee
Bayern Munich Werder Bremen
Gómez   72'
Schweinsteiger   38'
Özil   39'
Fritz   83'
3 22 August A Mainz 05  1 – 2 14 2 −1
Report Report link
Kick off
15:30 CEST
Attendance
20,300 (capacity)
Referee
Mainz 05 Bayern Munich
Ivanchitz   25'
Bancé   38'
Noveski   47' (o.g.)
4 29 August H VfL Wolfsburg 3 – 0 7 5 +2
Report Report link
Kick off
18:30 CEST
Attendance
69,000 (capacity)
Referee
Bayern Munich VfL Wolfsburg
Gómez   27'
Robben   68', 80'

Source: [citation needed]
1{{{t}}} goals come first.
Ground's country's flag and opponent's country's flag shown when from a different country of {{{t}}}.
Pos. = Position in league, Pts. = Points, GD = Goal difference, Ground: H = Home, A = Away, N = Neutral, HR = Home replacement, AR = Away replacement.

Comparison

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It's perfectly true that there will be a large number of games throughout the season, and showing them all would occupy much of the space of the article. It's also true that not all of the games are of equal notability. CSKA will play in the following tournaments, from most important to least important:

I experimented on which format would employ how much resources for the list. You can see the size of a page that would consist of a single match at the history page of Wikipedia's sandbox.

  • The format used up to now requires 811 bytes (edit summary footballbox collapsible), and shows everything.
  • The Liverpool page format requires 639 bytes (edit summary wikitable), and does not show the opponents' scorers or any cautions.
  • The Steaua page format requires 947 bytes (edit summary fb cm1 match), and shows everything. However, template:fb_team_ground_Dynamo_Moscow apparently has yet to be created, and the same applies for most of the A PFG teams. Therefore this patterns requires the creation of some templates.

It'd probably not be unwise to allocate different patterns for the different competitions, taking into consideration those factors such as number of games, level of notability of the games, space and bytes necessary per game, etc.

This page could serve as a comprehensive source for the kick-off times of all matches. By using it so, we would probably avoid the need of adducing citations of various foreign websites to support that sort of information. But CSKA's website still annoyingly tends to misinform about who certain goalscorers actually are, and the foreign sites would introduce some additional credibility to our article.

And if I'm sometimes absent from here for too long a time, don't forget I can be contacted on my talk page. Cheers! --Theurgist (talk) 14:47, 24 July 2010 (UTC)Reply

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